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DNG has less detail than JPG for A4000

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Offline Microfunguy

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Re: DNG has less detail than JPG for A4000
« Reply #30 on: 21 / June / 2013, 05:13:19 »
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Quote from: waterwingz on 20 / June / 2013, 23:56:44
What philmoz proved (with a subject that was likely to move) is that shooting in RAW leaves you with options in post processing

Phil's test is irrelevant to cameras used with CHDK raw.

The photo was taken with a Canon EOS 7D DSLR that costs about £1000 !!!!!

The challenge is still open ....
« Last Edit: 21 / June / 2013, 06:27:35 by Microfunguy »
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Offline blackhole

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Re: DNG has less detail than JPG for A4000
« Reply #31 on: 21 / June / 2013, 10:38:05 »
Test made with a A590, the bottom row is the 100% crop.Raw has more details and the colors are more natural.
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Offline Microfunguy

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Re: DNG has less detail than JPG for A4000
« Reply #32 on: 21 / June / 2013, 10:48:58 »
Quote from: blackhole on 21 / June / 2013, 10:38:05
Test made with a A590

Can you post the JPG and raw images somewhere and give details of what processing (if any) you did with the raw ?

I will then process the raw myself and see how much effort is involved.
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Offline blackhole

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Re: DNG has less detail than JPG for A4000
« Reply #33 on: 21 / June / 2013, 10:50:14 »
Wait a minute, I'll send a link
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Offline blackhole

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Re: DNG has less detail than JPG for A4000
« Reply #34 on: 21 / June / 2013, 11:02:18 »
PS Camera raw 5.4
Shaprening:
Amount 25
Radius 1.0
Detail 100
Masking 0
NR:
Luminance 0
Color 25

PS:
Curves
http://www20.zippyshare.com/v/95971978/file.html
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Offline Microfunguy

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Re: DNG has less detail than JPG for A4000
« Reply #35 on: 21 / June / 2013, 11:14:20 »
OK, thanks.

It will be later this evening in the UK when I look at this.

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Offline PS

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Re: DNG has less detail than JPG for A4000
« Reply #36 on: 21 / June / 2013, 12:27:52 »
Quote from: blackhole on 21 / June / 2013, 10:38:05
the colors are more natural.

How the colors appear depends on display, so it's not very obvious comparison. On my monitor there is no way to tell, which green is more accurate.
One very obvious example though is when camera's output is not ETTR (there are unused tones). Having original data lets you then encode image using whole available range.
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Offline acseven

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Re: DNG has less detail than JPG for A4000
« Reply #37 on: 21 / June / 2013, 12:35:32 »
A quick edit shows a lot of noise in the raw file, making it difficult for me to see if it has more detail or not. Maybe its related to the raw profile processing? I was using lightroom 3.6 in this case.

Note: the raw file is lighter on purpose, don't mind that.
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Offline rkomar

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Re: DNG has less detail than JPG for A4000
« Reply #38 on: 21 / June / 2013, 13:36:11 »
After much more fooling around, I've figured out that the detail is there in the RAW image I was looking at, it was just masked by the white balance and colour profile used to convert it to RGB.  If I use "no profile" in ufraw or RawTherapee, I can easily see the same details that are shown in the Canon JPG image.  So, there wasn't any information lost or hocus pocus done by the Canon firmware as I originally feared.  With RawTherapee, I can sharpen the image in much the same way that Canon does.  So what's left is the noise reduction.  The camera does a good job of smoothing the considerable noise in the A4000 without sacrificing much detail.  That seems to be the hard part for me to duplicate starting from the RAW image.

As a digital photography newb, I can say that this stuff is complicated!
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Offline blackhole

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Re: DNG has less detail than JPG for A4000
« Reply #39 on: 21 / June / 2013, 14:18:10 »
Quote
How the colors appear depends on display, so it's not very obvious comparison. On my monitor there is no way to tell, which green is more accurate.
You're right, on my monitor which is calibrated with Spyder4Elite colors look natural, how your monitor is calibrated I do not know.

Quote
A quick edit shows a lot of noise in the raw file, making it difficult for me to see if it has more detail or not. Maybe its related to the raw profile processing? I was using lightroom 3.6 in this case.

There seems to have more details, dot structure in jpeg is difficult to noticeable.


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