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"Unidentified image" and some other errors - CHDK related?

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Offline TMHKR

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"Unidentified image" and some other errors - CHDK related?
« on: 30 / May / 2015, 17:17:38 »
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Sometimes, my camera gives me the "Unidentified image" error on the last image I took. In some cases, I can fix it by power cycling the camera, but sometimes it remains. Can CHDK be the reason for this behavior?

SETUP:

Camera: SX170
Firmware: 1.01a
CHDK: latest stable 1.3.0
Loading: via Firm. Update menu
Card: Kingston SDHC 8GB Class 10
Settings: shooting RAW (in A/RAW folder), forced dark frame subtraction, no other overrides

I also sometimes get the prompt of fixing the memory card when I insert it into my card reader. As I already told you, sometimes I receive "Unidentified image" message with my current card. But with my previous card (old Transcend 2GB card), I received "Memory card error" message instead.

As for "A/RAW" storage option, I use it because with the standard "With JPEG" option some of my photos wouldn't load at all in Playback mode.

Perhaps it's the card fault after all, although the card is brand new? I might have to test it without CHDK, or with some diagnostic tool - any recommendations?
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Offline reyalp

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Re: "Unidentified image" and some other errors - CHDK related?
« Reply #1 on: 30 / May / 2015, 23:40:17 »
"unidentified image" might be shown if you delete a jpeg file using CHDK, until you reboot.

It could also be shown if there are CHDK raw files in the DCIM directory structure with certain combinations of prefix and extension, but if you have the raw directory set to A/RAW, I would expect them to be totally ignored by the canon firmware.

What are the raw prefix and extension set to?
Have you tried looking at the card in a card reader when the camera is showing this?
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Offline TMHKR

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  • Canon PowerShot SX170 IS (1.01a firmware)
Re: "Unidentified image" and some other errors - CHDK related?
« Reply #2 on: 31 / May / 2015, 06:00:34 »
Quote from: reyalp on 30 / May / 2015, 23:40:17
"unidentified image" might be shown if you delete a jpeg file using CHDK, until you reboot.

It could also be shown if there are CHDK raw files in the DCIM directory structure with certain combinations of prefix and extension, but if you have the raw directory set to A/RAW, I would expect them to be totally ignored by the canon firmware.

What are the raw prefix and extension set to?
Have you tried looking at the card in a card reader when the camera is showing this?

RAW prefix = CRW_
RAW extension = .CRW
DNG extension = Enabled

When I look at the card on my computer, the "Unidentified image" JPEGs open correctly - in most cases. As I said, when I had RAWs together with JPEGs in the DCIM directory, some of the JPEGs wouldn't load at all in the Playback mode (the activity LED would blink indefinitely).

Also note that I used to keep my photos on the card at all times (around 80 JPEGs), but now I'm trying to use the camera with nothing on the card but CHDK.
« Last Edit: 31 / May / 2015, 06:06:31 by TMHKR »
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Offline srsa_4c

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Re: "Unidentified image" and some other errors - CHDK related?
« Reply #3 on: 31 / May / 2015, 15:39:26 »
Quote from: TMHKR on 30 / May / 2015, 17:17:38
Sometimes, my camera gives me the "Unidentified image" error on the last image I took. In some cases, I can fix it by power cycling the camera, but sometimes it remains. Can CHDK be the reason for this behavior?
How often do you get this? I'd try using the same card without loading CHDK for a while. If you do this, start with formatting the card in camera.

Quote
I also sometimes get the prompt of fixing the memory card when I insert it into my card reader.
That sounds like filesystem corruption. CHDK should not cause something like this, unless it corrupts some memory that is used by the firmware's filesystem routines.
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Offline TMHKR

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  • Canon PowerShot SX170 IS (1.01a firmware)
Re: "Unidentified image" and some other errors - CHDK related?
« Reply #4 on: 31 / May / 2015, 19:03:02 »
Quote from: srsa_4c on 31 / May / 2015, 15:39:26
How often do you get this? I'd try using the same card without loading CHDK for a while. If you do this, start with formatting the card in camera.

Today, I took some photos (not much) without holding my usual JPEG collection in the DCIM directory - that is, I started with only CHDK on the card. No problems so far. I also changed the USB cable I used with my card reader, the old one was a bit loose. Since I don't want to set up CHDK and create badpixel.bin each time I reformat the card, I only move DCIM and RAW directories to the computer, leaving CHDK on the card.

Quote
That sounds like filesystem corruption. CHDK should not cause something like this, unless it corrupts some memory that is used by the firmware's filesystem routines.

Last night, I performed a test - I formatted the card on my computer, and then almost completely filled it up (a couple of huge, 4 GB ISO images). The copying process went without problems. I don't know if this test proves the card should work properly in the camera, that is, if the card was working fine.

Conclusion? It seems that some cameras don't like gigabytes of RAW files on the card - perhaps it "confuses" the file system somehow, and then camera encounters errors. I will use the camera further, and report if it happens again.

But if that means that I will encounter these errors if I, for example, spend a day shooting some 100 photos (their corresponding RAWs would eat the space very quickly), then we have a problem - what's the use of all this, if I can only spend 1/3 of my card at once?
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Offline srsa_4c

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Re: "Unidentified image" and some other errors - CHDK related?
« Reply #5 on: 31 / May / 2015, 19:31:02 »
Quote from: TMHKR on 31 / May / 2015, 19:03:02
Conclusion? It seems that some cameras don't like gigabytes of RAW files on the card - perhaps it "confuses" the file system somehow, and then camera encounters errors.
No way. The firmware only cares about file types it knows, and it also ignores anything that is not in the DCIM folder. It also has to be able to use SDXC cards - sized 64GB or greater.
Since card readers exist, camera owners can decide to store other data on the card - this should not cause problems of this kind (except when someone starts messing with files under DCIM/).

Possible causes of your problem:
- the camera (or card) has a hw problem
- the firmware is corrupted (try dumping it and comparing it to the one in our repo)
- RAM corruption caused by CHDK (directly or indirectly)
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Offline TMHKR

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  • Canon PowerShot SX170 IS (1.01a firmware)
Re: "Unidentified image" and some other errors - CHDK related?
« Reply #6 on: 31 / May / 2015, 20:37:10 »
Quote from: srsa_4c on 31 / May / 2015, 19:31:02
Possible causes of your problem:
- the camera (or card) has a hw problem
- the firmware is corrupted (try dumping it and comparing it to the one in our repo)
- RAM corruption caused by CHDK (directly or indirectly)

- I hope it's not the camera; the card can be replaced, although I believe the card is not the cause

- What is the quickest (read: safest) way to dump a firmware? My camera came with 1.01a

- It might be, since you (or nafraf) told me that it seems there's not enough free RAM after CHDK has been loaded on the SX170, and that I should test it... but at that time I didn't use RAW very much

By the way, what's the use of CANONMSC folder in the DCIM directory? It contains some .CTG files, which are created when I view photos in the Playback mode. Some sort of thumbnail storage?
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Offline reyalp

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Re: "Unidentified image" and some other errors - CHDK related?
« Reply #7 on: 31 / May / 2015, 23:41:56 »
Quote from: TMHKR on 31 / May / 2015, 20:37:10
- What is the quickest (read: safest) way to dump a firmware? My camera came with 1.01a
http://chdk.wikia.com/wiki/Canon_Basic/Scripts/Dumper

Another question:
If the camera is showing the error, does it keep showing after a reboot? If so, try rebooting without CHDK (unlock the card to prevent autoboot)
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Offline TMHKR

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Re: "Unidentified image" and some other errors - CHDK related?
« Reply #8 on: 01 / June / 2015, 07:05:45 »
Quote from: reyalp on 31 / May / 2015, 23:41:56
Another question:
If the camera is showing the error, does it keep showing after a reboot? If so, try rebooting without CHDK (unlock the card to prevent autoboot)

The last couple of times "Unidentified Image" error happened, a simple reboot did the trick. I don't use the auto-boot, I always start CHDK via Firmware Update menu.
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