No. Not everybody uses it. A lot of people still use IE, since it ships with Windows and recently got functionality that rivals Firefox for the simple user. I use Opera and I'm certainly not the only one. Then there's still Safari, Konqueror, etc. You probably didn't hear of a lot of software but that doesn't mean 'everyone' uses what you use.
Anyway, why do you keep insisting on separate hosting? It works fine the way it is now and frankly, to get CHDK I don't need to wait anywhere. I can either just checkout the source or download a binary from GrAnd. I do agree that the zshare 1-minute wait is annoying, but it's only that. It's not like you need to use it several times a day.. and it's just one minute. If we really need a place to host stuff, there's GrAnd's hosting, I have 4GB at my university, acseven might be able to help... enough possibilities here. Again, putting it all in one package can only cause trouble, especially if you don't want to spend any money on it. This project may be free but webhosters want to earn money regardless of what you're hosting. (Also, it might be useful to notice that all "Unlimited bandwidth/storage" packages are cheap, whereas business/enterprise hosting with SLAs etc is expensive. There are no expensive "unlimited" packages, because nobody wants to guarantee unlimited use. Really, don't try to move big projects to ultra-cheap hosting.)
As for 'n00bs'... why do they *need* CHDK? I don't think anyone would install CHDK 'for the fun of it', to do nothing useful with it. My opinion: if someone feels that he/she 'needs' it, he/she will have to put some effort into it. Why else would you consider yourself a power-user?
Properly reading the FAQ/manual is the key to actually understanding what CHDK does and why it does things... and it limits the chances of user error. People already spent a lot of time in writing documentation. Sure, it can be shortened in some cases, but this should definitely not be done to generalize 'for all models'. As you've proven in your small tutorial/video, you easily miss things, especially if you don't look at it from the developer's point of view.
I personally think the documentation is quite understandable and should allow anyone to install CHDK on his own in under an hour. People tend to rush into things, half an hour isn't 'too long'. Everyone should take the time to read what they're actually doing, because some actions can destroy data if you're not careful enough.
Helping people in chat or whatever: if you've done that for a while or lurked in a helpdesk-type channel, you'll notice that most of the questions are actually already answered in the FAQ. You'd have to repeat the FAQ because someone is apparently too lazy to read it. That doesn't work for me. It makes people lazy and it encourages rushing through the installation process. Not only with CHDK, but they'll expect the same level of support and step-by-step live-chat help from other projects as well. The instructions are simple enough and if you can't understand them, you should probably not be using CHDK, you're bound to run into other problems. Famous quote: "Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day. Teach a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime."
What may be done, though, is *restructuring* the FAQ, instructions and maybe the wiki... and a cleanup. A lot of pages are semi-outdated and information is scattered around a bit. It'd probably be a big help for 'newbies' if they didn't have to put much effort into searching (although that might also be a bad thing). Another result of the somewhat scattered state of the wiki is that people (like you) start creating new guides which are.... heh... essentially in the FAQ already.
Last but not least, when making big changes to the wiki (i.e. a front-page link to a tutorial or whatever), get it reviewed by someone before actually linking to it, potentially causing some people to do bad things. It's very easy to miss errors/omissions in things you made yourself and peer-review is a very good tool to getting a correct article.
Call me hippie, but organic growth communities only work when they are small.
So have much fun with that 24/7 !(OK - would be no problem for you - you also can do that in ~ 10 foreign languages...)
It'll become yours AND ours faster you can say "shxx happens !"...Canon's legal department, Canon's barristers, Canon's modifications for the upcoming camera generation (btw. - seems we have this reaction already on the new encrypted Canon firmwares)...Let sleepin' dogs lie, they'll bite you !Prosit
Cuz CHDK is so kool and I think everybody should have it
QuoteCuz CHDK is so kool and I think everybody should have itIt seems to me that you rather think"Cuz CHDK is so kool and I think everybody should MUST have it."
I think if we (me, a few good writers, a few devs, and some people people Tongue) wrote a nice letter to Canon, explaining everything, and the advantages they would have in fully supporting us, it would solve a whole bunch of issues.
Course I heard of all of them. However, all the ppl I work with use Firefox as their main browser, and most of them are computer illiterate. Maybe its just my skool and friends, but Firefox has taken over the browser world
Cuz CHDK is so kool and I think everybody should have it. It lets even newbies have some features that they could use (battery indicator, etc). And I know lots of ppl who love cams but are clueless in comps. Anyways, I think everybody should have an easy way to get CHDK, and that is what I plan to accomplish.
People would rather watch a vid than read a documentation. When I looked at the FAQ the first time I was "Oh God, how am I supposed to read all of this!" And as for missing stuff easily, that's why we have a community, to point out mistakes of others, and make stuff better. That's the only way to make a perfect tutorial/video.
Under an hour is the key word. Most people won't spend more than 5 minutes on this unless you get them interested. We need to give them a quick "push" in the right direction. Then once they install CHDK, start seeing the features, they can read documentation, etc. Tell me, out of all the people you know, how many have actually read the documentation to their camera? I know for a fact that less than 5% of my friends have ever gone near it
Ok...might not work for you, so you just don't go into the helpdesk chatroom. I will handle it. Also this is needed in order to build a FAQ of problems which users actually have rather than problems devs might think they have. Computer-literate people assume that everybody knows what they're talking about (I know I do ). That's why we need real-people experience. A helpdesk chatroom is exactly that. I will be in there whenever I can answering stupid questions. No work on your (or anybody else's) part unless they want to. I just ask to put CHDK Chat in an easy to see place.
Another reason we need a helpdesk. To see how newbies approach installing CHDK. Then we restructure the wiki to that standard. Also, the difference between my guide and FAQ guide is that:a) People need to know what FAQ isb) People need to know to look in FAQc) People have to search for it in the FAQ
The basics: how to install and use the CHDK firmware CHDK In Brief - What is CHDK? How do I get started? FAQ / Instructions - Lots of good stuff here. (Installation Instruction,Supported Camera Models,Troubleshooting etc.) Firmware Usage - The main CHDK Manual, explaining all the original features. Allbest Firmware Usage - The new Allbest CHDK builds required a whole new page added to explain the vast array of new features. This is the HELP section. (a work in progress, please help!)
Mmmm...I suppose...but I would imagine Canon would gain $ from ppl using CHDK. CHDK got me to buy a Canon rather than a Kodak. I think if we (me, a few good writers, a few devs, and some people people ) wrote a nice letter to Canon, explaining everything, and the advantages they would have in fully supporting us, it would solve a whole bunch of issues.
Sorry, but IMO this is extremly quixotic and blue-eyed...I GIVE UP - Now it's time for me to do some meaningfull WORK, enough babbled.
[bright red, over the top, bold, needlessly large font]Edit:[/all that]I read all of it. Ironically, it inspired me that writing to Canon was a good id. That RaduP guy is my new role model. He is just like me, except smarter, and knows assembly, and can come up with great points. Anyways, I DataGhost, I got the impression that you somewhat supported writing to Canon (at least later on in the thread).
I don't think boycotting would be wise, but I think that it is best for Canon to give out the firmware.
First off, as noted in the thread, it is extremely simple to reverse-engineer for huge competing companies (like Nikon say...) If they really wanted to get Canon's firmware, believe me, they would find a way. If small hackers like the ones in the CHDK community were able to do it with virtually no money, imagine what Nikon would be able to do with a team of trained Harvard/Yale graduates with 6 digit salaries would be able to do.
Next, as RaduP said:1. CHDK breaks no law (not even DMCA) - they can't do anything against us. As long as we keep the fimware on a secure server accessible only to Devs (or ppl who sign an agreement not to disclose anything that goes on in there, and swears that they do not work for Canon) they have no proof against us. We are just a bunch of people randomly putting information on our memory cards, and extra features "happen" to pop up. Then again saying this would leave me open for the "writing to them would give them a written record" argument...so...dunno whether that was a wise decision in my place to post that...
2. That will be a lot of bad publicity for them. I for one would not hesitate to boycott them if they do such a stupid thing. - Ok...maybe not boycott (I can't live without my Canon ), but still if we petition against them, and they refuse, it would raise up a lot of controversy, which would hurt Canon.
3. They indirectly benefit from it. More sold P&S cameras. - EXACTLY! That is the main point. As I said before, I bought my Canon because I could run CHDK on it. Shutting down CHDK = losing customers. Also as I said before, Camera hacking is the future of cameras. If they reject it, they fall behind.
Finally, as I said before, not contacting Canon is just avoiding the problem. It's coming sooner or later. More people will find out about CHDK...much much more...As you can see from forum stats:CHDK will get popular sooner or later, and Canon will be forced to make a choice. It's better that they make the choice now
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Started by rocstar General Chat
Started by Raistlin General Help and Assistance on using CHDK stable releases
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