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Infrared and Motion Detection?

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Offline gsbergman

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Infrared and Motion Detection?
« on: 12 / February / 2009, 17:26:09 »
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Does anyone know if I had a Canon PS camera modified for infrared (by removal of the IR cutoff filter) to operate in the 830nm area, would the camera and motion detection script still detect motion? Obviously I would require illumination in the 830nm spectrum. I'm looking to perform work in the dark with the subject undisturbed during sleep.

Thanks in advance,
Gregg

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Offline Microfunguy

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Re: Infrared and Motion Detection?
« Reply #1 on: 12 / February / 2009, 17:45:34 »
Quote from: gsbergman on 12 / February / 2009, 17:26:09
would the camera and motion detection script still detect motion?

I have just tried putting an IR-pass filter for about that wavelength (it is optically opaque) in front of my A620 lens.

I increased the brightness of a 12V halogen lamp until I could see a feint purple image on the camera screen when I pointed the camera directly at it.

When I moved the camera it took a photo.

So, it all depends just how intense your IR illumination is and whether removing the camera's own IR-blocking filter makes much difference.



David
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Offline dom-a

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Re: Infrared and Motion Detection?
« Reply #2 on: 12 / February / 2009, 19:07:39 »
Long Answer.
My understanding of the motion detection script is. The script uses brightness levels to detect motion so if you can see stuff with your camera yes it will.

Short answer.
Yes.
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Offline PhyrePhoX

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Re: Infrared and Motion Detection?
« Reply #3 on: 14 / February / 2009, 05:10:38 »
let us know how you removed the ir filter and if you gain much more ir sensitivity through that. also please enlighten us what subject you are tracking there...
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Offline waldo

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Re: Infrared and Motion Detection?
« Reply #4 on: 14 / February / 2009, 11:11:58 »
I use CHDK with a camera modified by removing the IR-cut filter and adding a IR-pass filter.  The sensitivity to IR is similar to sensitivity to visible light with a normal camera.
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Offline gsbergman

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Re: Infrared and Motion Detection?
« Reply #5 on: 14 / February / 2009, 15:03:55 »
I have not actually modified a camera yet. I was thinking of buying a professionally converted IR camera from www.maxmax.com.

The subject is me.

I'm suffering from a sleeping disorder (RLS) and have been shooting myself using my A720IS running the motion detection script.
Currently I'm monitoring my progress on a daily basis and the light might be affecting my sleep. I want to continue my monitoring with the least intrusive method, which I figured was IR.

Read the Thank You posting on the Wiki.
http://chdk.wikia.com/wiki/Talk:THANKS#My_thanks_to_all_that_contribute_to_this_incredible_piece_of_work.

Only bad part of this is I have to leave a light on in the room to accomplish this. I wanted to try this in near complete darkness using an IR modified camera and using IR illumination within the same spectrum.
« Last Edit: 14 / February / 2009, 15:27:55 by gsbergman »
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Offline gsbergman

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Re: Infrared and Motion Detection?
« Reply #6 on: 14 / February / 2009, 15:22:03 »
Quote
I use CHDK with a camera modified by removing the IR-cut filter and adding a IR-pass filter.  The sensitivity to IR is similar to sensitivity to visible light with a normal camera.
Waldo,

What camera are you using?, and how/who performed your modification?
I'd like to either mod my A720IS or buy an A590IS to modify before I spend big money on a professionally modded camera.

Thank,
Gregg
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Offline PhyrePhoX

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Re: Infrared and Motion Detection?
« Reply #7 on: 14 / February / 2009, 16:34:19 »
Quote from: gsbergman on 14 / February / 2009, 15:03:55
I have not actually modified a camera yet. I was thinking of buying a professionally converted IR camera from www.maxmax.com.

The subject is me.

I'm suffering from a sleeping disorder (RLS) and have been shooting myself using my A720IS running the motion detection script.
Currently I'm monitoring my progress on a daily basis and the light might be affecting my sleep. I want to continue my monitoring with the least intrusive method, which I figured was IR.

Read the Thank You posting on the Wiki.
http://chdk.wikia.com/wiki/Talk:THANKS#My_thanks_to_all_that_contribute_to_this_incredible_piece_of_work.

Only bad part of this is I have to leave a light on in the room to accomplish this. I wanted to try this in near complete darkness using an IR modified camera and using IR illumination within the same spectrum.

imo you have a few options here:
why use motion detection? just take pictures all the time! you will then also see the subtle movements (which wont trigger MD). just set a high iso (you dont need supersharp, denoised pics in this case i guess) and a long shutter and take pictures like every 30 seconds - then you can create some sort of timelapse and you can track your movement in a very precise way (you need a quite large sd card and perhaps a power supply for this - cheaper than a modded IR cam though).

you could also buy two items: a powersupply for your camera and a "IR gel" for the flash. set cam to manual mode, high iso again (but fast shutter) and open aperture, then use the flash in manual mode - the IR gel will only let IR light through, which will not interfere with your sleep. this way you would have sharp pictures. take a look at for example the pics by weegee, a famous photog from last century: http://jkaranka.blogspot.com/2008/01/how-to-infrared-flash.html
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Offline waldo

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Re: Infrared and Motion Detection?
« Reply #8 on: 14 / February / 2009, 19:10:55 »
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What camera are you using?, and how/who performed your modification?

I'm using a SD400.  I modified it myself and it's a pretty delicate operation.  It involves removing the image sensor to get access to the IR hot filter.  Even Canon will not repair cameras that require touching the image sensor.  My conversion went fine, but it involved custom cutting of an optical window and it was very difficult to realign the image sensor so that the image was correctly focused in the corners.  You could search the web and find more info on the process.
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Offline gsbergman

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Re: Infrared and Motion Detection?
« Reply #9 on: 15 / February / 2009, 12:53:34 »
I found an A580 modified for IR on eBay. Then I noticed the 580 was not ported for CHDK. The camera is reasonably priced. How difficult would it be for someone to port CHDK to work with the A580. As I understand it is similar to the a590IS without the IS.
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