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Simplified UI / Overworking CHDK Interface

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Offline tilllt

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Simplified UI / Overworking CHDK Interface
« on: 19 / September / 2009, 02:24:54 »
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Hello People,

i have a SD880 / Ixus 870is and i am using the current CHDK port for it. My feeling is that there is a huge gap (or learning cruve, so to say) between the original Canon Firmwares and the CHDK features. I can definitely sit down and read the CHDK User Manual and figure out how to do things, but sometimes i feel CHDK itself could make this a lot easier by having overworked its User Interface... I guess for many CHDK users, like myself, the main features are:

Shooting Raw and having access to more manual controls

Especially the Manual Settings part of CHDK is quite incomprehensible, if you are used to the logic Av / Tv / M Modes as they are implemented since decades of analog and digital cameras. I am no programmer so i cannot help with this coding part but, as (i think) all the features are already present in CHDK, i could help thinking about a simplified UI for the basic Manual modes, made possible by CHDK. Are there any thoughts on this already in the forum or would anyone be interested in this?

Maybe rethinking what setting goes in which menu, how the menus are named, changing the UI Logic of how to set up things would help a lot already.

Anone any thoughts on this?

Cheers,
till
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Offline reyalp

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Re: Simplified UI / Overworking CHDK Interface
« Reply #1 on: 19 / September / 2009, 02:49:47 »
The whole UI system could do with a re-write, and doing something more like the canon UI (or even re-using the canon UI code if that turns out not to be to difficult) for commonly used functions would certainly be one way to go.

However, this would take a lot of developer effort to do right. CHDK developers are volunteers, and tend to spend their time developing things that they want in CHDK. From this POV, reworking the UI is not really that rewarding. There are a lot of other things that need cleaning up too.

As far as usability with the current version goes, you might want to look into the user menu and the various shortcut keys.
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Offline RaduP

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Re: Simplified UI / Overworking CHDK Interface
« Reply #2 on: 19 / September / 2009, 22:41:35 »
I agree, would be nice to have a menu where you can just set the aperture, exposure time, ISO and focus distance and not have to bother with multipliers and 'enable overrides' and stuff like that.
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Offline tilllt

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Re: Simplified UI / Overworking CHDK Interface
« Reply #3 on: 20 / September / 2009, 00:37:12 »
Thats exactly the part i was referring to. Until you read the manual, the Term "Value Factor" doesnt make a lot of sense, especially as it does not imply if the Value Factor for "Overrride Shutter Speed" is in any way related to the Aperture...

Also, it may make sense for some people to have such a detailed option to set speeds etc. But the normal Shutter Speed scale that analog Cameras are usually sufficient.

Also the linguistic double negative construction of the main override switch:
Disable Overrides: On / Disable / Off

I mean, in normal language logic, what does "I turned the Disable Override function Off" say, in comparison to "The disable Overrides function is disabled?"

Maybe it would be easier to understand to name it
Enable Overrides: Yes / No / Selective

Or is there some kind of internal logic why this doesnt make sense?

Cheers
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Offline reyalp

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Re: Simplified UI / Overworking CHDK Interface
« Reply #4 on: 20 / September / 2009, 00:47:40 »
Quote from: tilllt on 20 / September / 2009, 00:37:12
Thats exactly the part i was referring to. Until you read the manual, the Term "Value Factor" doesnt make a lot of sense,
If you use "EV step" instead of "value factor" you get more traditional values.
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especially as it does not imply if the Value Factor for "Overrride Shutter Speed" is in any way related to the Aperture...
Huh ? I have no idea what you are trying to say here. Value factor in shutter speed is not related to aperture...
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I mean, in normal language logic, what does "I turned the Disable Override function Off" say, in comparison to "The disable Overrides function is disabled?"

Maybe it would be easier to understand to name it
Enable Overrides: Yes / No / Selective
Yes, that one bugs me too, and your suggestion would make more sense. (although selective probably wouldn't fit. Select ?)
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Offline tilllt

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Re: Simplified UI / Overworking CHDK Interface
« Reply #5 on: 20 / September / 2009, 05:39:48 »
Maybe i still didnt understand if the CHDK equivalent to Aperture / Shutter priority (frequently referred to as "Av / Tv" modes in cameras exist or how to achieve it - or if its not implemented in the SD880 Version of CHDK. Please forgive me if i didnt understand the technical aspects of the possibility to make a menu like this, i attached a menu proposal as i could imagine a "Simple Manual Menu".
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Offline fe50

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Re: Simplified UI / Overworking CHDK Interface
« Reply #6 on: 20 / September / 2009, 06:18:57 »
Quote from: tilllt on 20 / September / 2009, 00:37:12
Also the linguistic double negative construction of the main override switch:
Disable Overrides: On / Disable / Off
I mean, in normal language logic, what does "I turned the Disable Override function Off" say, in comparison to "The disable Overrides function is disabled?"
Maybe it would be easier to understand to name it
Enable Overrides: Yes / No / Selective
Or is there some kind of internal logic why this doesnt make sense?
Yes - Enable Overrides: Yes / No / Selective would be wrong, read Disable_Overrides.


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Offline fe50

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Re: Simplified UI / Overworking CHDK Interface
« Reply #7 on: 20 / September / 2009, 07:03:09 »
@tilllt
There are much menu items with "internal logic" in CHDK, it's not that easy to control the features / overrides / settings in a "simple" menu.

The menu items also differs between cameras - e.g. the SD880 (as all or most IXUS cameras) has no "real" aperture (iris diaphragm), but a ND filter (which most or even all A-series cams do not have).

Have you ever tried the CHDK user menu ?
You can create your own menu with your preferred settings/items, similar to your suggestion...

About the "CHDK equivalent to Aperture / Shutter priority":
The CHDK "system" don't work with priorities or similar - you set "real" values, either a fix aperture setting or a fix shutter speed (time) value - or even both, maybe together with other settings...

This way you have full manual control - but you have to adjust / set up all the things correctly by yourself; if you don't want this, the Canon user interface with its (limited, but safe) controls & menues may be the better choice...

Note: you can edit the language files to "rename" the menu items to your needs, very simple & neds no changes in the code...
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