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CHDK UI version 2.0 ?

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Offline msl

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Re: CHDK UI version 2.0 ?
« Reply #150 on: 01 / July / 2012, 15:58:11 »
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NO (sorry)

Any renaming in the menu entries also needs a change in the documentation! And one word as description for a main menu entry is a little bit poor. We all here know CHDK! But a newbie is happy about any extended description.

Btw, everyone can make his own language file or we provide a language file for power user. ;)

Quote from: waterwingz on 01 / July / 2012, 15:23:28
Why not put the USB remote menu link on the Main Menu too?

Not everyone has a remote control. I think, it's more a thing for the user menu.

msl
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Offline waterwingz

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Re: CHDK UI version 2.0 ?
« Reply #151 on: 01 / July / 2012, 16:24:09 »
(Note : comments below are not intended to turn this thread into a flame war ..)

Quote from: msl on 01 / July / 2012, 15:58:11
NO (sorry)
So we will mark you down as "not in favor".

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Any renaming in the menu entries also needs a change in the documentation!
Philmoz was already going down the path of changing the Main Menu.   "In for a penny,  in for a pound" as our British friends would say.

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And one word as description for a main menu entry is a little bit poor. We all here know CHDK! But a newbie is happy about any extended description.
Not sure I agree.  Those single words describes the functionality pretty well - and what you get if you click there.  Adding the word Parameter after each entry does not change the meaning but does makes the menu look crowded (IMO) ... one reason Apple has done so well with their iPod/pad/phone devices is clean and simple user interfaces.  They put a lot of work into that !

And Raw, Zebra and Histogram have the word "Parameters" after them but Edge Overlay does not.  Why ?

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Btw, everyone can make his own language file or we provide a language file for power user. ;)
True.  And everyone can recompile from scratch and do anything they want.  But the intent of this thread is about trying to make the UI cleaner and easier to understand for the average user.

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Not everyone has a remote control. I think, it's more a thing for the user menu.
I was thinking mostly about what you need to get to quickly. Not everyone uses all CHDK functions so which ones make most sense to get "main menu" status ?
« Last Edit: 01 / July / 2012, 16:27:00 by waterwingz »
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Offline msl

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Re: CHDK UI version 2.0 ?
« Reply #152 on: 01 / July / 2012, 16:59:11 »
Quote from: waterwingz on 01 / July / 2012, 16:24:09
But the intent of this thread is about trying to make the UI cleaner and easier to understand for the average user.

Yes you're right. Nevertheless some thoughts.

The German translation uses more uniform designations, but not too short. I think, an entry like a simple 'RAW' says nothing and and looks like sh*t (sorry). We have the place for short descriptions. A comparison with iPod/pad/phone devices is not the best idea - see discussion about symbols & icons.

The USB remote control is a hardware extension. Not everyone uses them. You need also a d.i.y. skill. That is for me the reason to put it not in main menu. Zebra, histogram or edge overlay, anyone can use this functions.

msl





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Offline waterwingz

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Re: CHDK UI version 2.0 ?
« Reply #153 on: 01 / July / 2012, 17:21:32 »
Quote from: msl on 01 / July / 2012, 16:59:11
The German translation uses more uniform designations, but not too short.
That's funny -  I've usually found that the translation of technical words into German from English to be ... umm ... shall we say, a little long ?

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I think, an entry like a simple 'RAW' says nothing and and looks like sh*t (sorry). We have the place for short descriptions. A comparison with iPod/pad/phone devices is not the best idea - see discussion about symbols & icons.
I suppose this comes down to personal taste.  And in that case, its probably not worth changing something established (given the documentation challenges) unless there is an overwhelming consensus that the change will really make things a lot better.

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The USB remote control is a hardware extension. Not everyone uses them. You need also a d.i.y. skill.
Or the ability to go to amazon or ebay and buy a CA-1 ;)
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Offline reyalp

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Re: CHDK UI version 2.0 ?
« Reply #154 on: 01 / July / 2012, 17:21:50 »
Quote from: msl on 01 / July / 2012, 16:59:11
The German translation uses more uniform designations, but not too short. I think, an entry like a simple 'RAW' says nothing and and looks like sh*t (sorry). We have the place for short descriptions.
I wonder if this is a linguistic difference. My gut reaction is similar to what waterwingz said: just "Raw" means... this menu is everything related to raw files. "Raw settings" or "Raw parameters" doesn't really add any information. The only confusion I see would be thinking the menu item would immediately enable raw, but as soon as you selected it you would know.

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The USB remote control is a hardware extension. Not everyone uses them. You need also a d.i.y. skill. That is for me the reason to put it not in main menu. Zebra, histogram or edge overlay, anyone can use this functions.
I generally agree, but there are two different questions here:
1) What do most users use. It's safe to say USB remote does not qualify.
2) What do users who use the feature want to access quickly. There is a case that USB remote qualifies.

If there is sufficient space in the menu, it might be worth considering including options based on the #2. However, the user menu seems like a good alternative.
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Offline waterwingz

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Re: CHDK UI version 2.0 ?
« Reply #155 on: 01 / July / 2012, 17:27:51 »
Great discussions here !    And I'm sure we all agree that nobody is going to leave upset if one feature or another does not get added or changed.

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Offline msl

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Re: CHDK UI version 2.0 ?
« Reply #156 on: 01 / July / 2012, 17:45:03 »
Quote from: waterwingz on 01 / July / 2012, 17:21:32
That's funny ...

What is here funny - your respect for other opinions? ;)

I see some things differently. We had the same discussion 3 years ago in the German forum. The result was the current german translation. I also have no problem in accepting one another majority opinion.

Quote from: waterwingz on 01 / July / 2012, 17:21:32
Or the ability to go to amazon or ebay and buy a CA-1 ;)

On this argument I had been waiting.  ;)

msl
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Offline waterwingz

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Re: CHDK UI version 2.0 ?
« Reply #157 on: 01 / July / 2012, 18:09:47 »
Quote from: msl on 01 / July / 2012, 17:45:03
Quote from: waterwingz on 01 / July / 2012, 17:21:32
That's funny ...
What is here funny - your respect for other opinions? ;)
Please accept my apology .. I sometimes forget that attempts at humor do not always translate well across languages.

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I see some things differently. We had the same discussion 3 years ago in the German forum. The result was the current german translation. I also have no problem in accepting one another majority opinion.
We all see things a little differently.  And I enjoy discussing those differences.

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Quote from: waterwingz on 01 / July / 2012, 17:21:32
Or the ability to go to amazon or ebay and buy a CA-1 ;)

On this argument I had been waiting.  ;)
Okay - you lost me on this last one ....
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Offline outslider

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Re: CHDK UI version 2.0 ?
« Reply #158 on: 02 / July / 2012, 02:51:40 »
I had no idea that this minor renaming proposition will cause such long discussion... Maybe I'll try to do some change in my proposal to make all of you happy.

I agree with waterwingz (and myself) that word 'parameters' doesn't mean anything, so it's useless in menu. But I agree with msl that 'RAW' is too short and there could be some description. So maybe:

  • RAW - digital negative
  • Zebra - overexposured regions
  • Histogram - color distribution
  • Edge overlay - panorama tool
  • Script - program your camera
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Offline msl

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Re: CHDK UI version 2.0 ?
« Reply #159 on: 02 / July / 2012, 04:07:19 »
Thanks outslider!

This proposal is the right way.

On the whole discussion we should not forget, there is Phil's test branch. And this branch needs more test results.

Not only the main menu is a topic. Also the reorganization of the submenus should be considered and tested. And the new help screen is a good tool to better understand CHDK.

msl
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