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"Junior Participant" section of the "CHDK Development"

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"Junior Participant" section of the "CHDK Development"
« on: 08 / April / 2008, 09:19:49 »
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I have an idea on how to encourage and incorporate the help of anyone that visits here, who has both a camera and an interest in CHDK.

There seems to be a small number of participants doing the bulk of the work, and I can suggest a possibility as to why.
-Everything is too advanced!
I don't understand much about programming, but I do have a camera that is in the development stages here for CHDK. I wish to help out, but the amount that needs to be learned first is simply too overwhelming for me to just "dive in" and know what I'm doing.
As a "Junior Participant" under the direction of someone who knows all about this stuff, I could perform simple, structured tests and present my results on a dedicated "Junior Participant's Page" in the Wikia.
I believe that breaking down testing and making it structured would encourage a larger group of participants with limited experience who otherwise shy away from the extreme dedication that seems necessary to participate. All of these little  gold nuggets of information contributed by a much larger group could be compiled easily (I should think) by the more experienced persons. The tests would need to be very, very basic. S-p-e-l-l it out, but don't be condescending!
There are people who know nothing of programming who are also very intelligent. There are also people who simply don't CARE about the programming part, and let's face it, -this is a programming enthusiast board more than it is a photography enthusiast board, no? If it offered more of the latter, perhaps there would be more persons willing to test.
Advanced members would need to moderate the "Junior Participant" section to post needed tests, put up polls to see result variations, and close threads when each particular test was completed. A dedicated page could be made for the results to be compiled, and again, a more experienced participant could analyze the data and make something of it.
This would also solve Barney Fifes justifiable grudge about info being scattered throughout the forum.

As a forum member with no experience who does wish to participate, I have no idea what I'm doing, and I could stumble upon something really significant and not realize it. I also end up asking questions about completely insignificant things that demonstrate my ignorance of all of this and am met with rather cold shouldered responses as if I'm 'bothersome".
For all of the members who do work very hard on CHDK and seem extremely "bothered" by those who have "user" interests and not necessarily "programmer" interests, this new section offers a place they can send those members.


It's just a suggestion to help. I wish I could be of more help. As I told another member member, "I'm just a jeweler."
You smite like a girl!

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Offline PhyrePhoX

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Re: "Junior Participant" section of the "CHDK Development"
« Reply #1 on: 08 / April / 2008, 10:06:15 »
hm, i code chdk stuff, and it was hard at first (see this thread that started it all: Remaining RAW+JPG shots + filespace icon/text- done :D ) . my code isnt checked into the official code, it is "checked and supervised" by people like Allbest. In my threads i constantly offer betabuilds & feature descriptions and always encourage people to download these builds and test, and write suggestions & critics and the like. what can you do?
well, you can see the latest "unofficial" changes here: Timeline - chdk - Trac
to get a build that has these latest changes incroporated, go here: Index of /hdk/autobuild/
if you see in the timeline that there was a feature introduced that also affects your camera, you can test that. if it doesnt work, you can create a bugreport.
speaking of bugreports: grAnd and acseven (the forum admin) are planning top open up a dedicated bugreport-server, in which - i'm sure - you can also be given tasks (in the role of betatester), this will make life much easier than it is now.

Re: "Junior Participant" section of the "CHDK Development"
« Reply #2 on: 08 / April / 2008, 12:05:40 »
The more I read past posts by certain persons on this forum, the more I realize that it's not just the programming that is over my head. It's also the politics.
You smite like a girl!

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Offline GrAnd

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Re: "Junior Participant" section of the "CHDK Development"
« Reply #3 on: 08 / April / 2008, 14:07:23 »
I think, that's due to laziness of programmers. The are usually so disorganized. :)
They like to have fun with experiments and to talk off-topic. But when they were asked to summarize, structure and document their experience they have no time for that.  :P

Almost any newbie is so wowed, inspired and encouraged by CHDK first time and tempted to do something by himself. But when he looks deeper and faced with all these difficulties (not only in communication) he loses his motivation. Especially in case if the CHDK had been already ported to his cam. Not many goes further and continues digging in disassemblers. That's my opinion.

PS. And not all persons, who have the knowledge, can type at 130wpm and knows English fluently.  ::)  (electronic dictionaries are rulez)
CHDK Developer.


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Offline wontolla

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Re: "Junior Participant" section of the "CHDK Development"
« Reply #4 on: 08 / April / 2008, 14:09:06 »

Re: "Junior Participant" section of the "CHDK Development"
« Reply #5 on: 08 / April / 2008, 15:02:10 »
One of these days login in dpreview Pro forum and you'll see what is to be bothersome, rude, harassing, arrogant etc. Try to post a humble question and they will annihilate you.
I've been banned from dpreview. Many times. As a whole, they frown on craftsman o=and hobbyists like myself who do things like make a telephoto lens bracket for a Canon P&S, but there were just enough members like me to make me keep coming back.
No more, though. Too many of the core members there no longer seem interested in photography nearly as much as being obnoxious to the lesser experienced members.

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Offline adcz

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Re: "Junior Participant" section of the "CHDK Development"
« Reply #6 on: 08 / June / 2008, 17:20:23 »
I have an idea on how to encourage and incorporate the help of anyone that visits here, who has both a camera and an interest in CHDK.
And I would love to help!!!

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There seems to be a small number of participants doing the bulk of the work, and I can suggest a possibility as to why.
-Everything is too advanced!
Yup :) Well not advanced...it's just I (and most ppl who visit CHDK) don't know C (tho I plan on learning soon!), and that's just about the only way you can directly help dev CHDK.

Quote
I don't understand much about programming, but I do have a camera that is in the development stages here for CHDK. I wish to help out, but the amount that needs to be learned first is simply too overwhelming for me to just "dive in" and know what I'm doing.
As a "Junior Participant" under the direction of someone who knows all about this stuff, I could perform simple, structured tests and present my results on a dedicated "Junior Participant's Page" in the Wikia.
I believe that breaking down testing and making it structured would encourage a larger group of participants with limited experience who otherwise shy away from the extreme dedication that seems necessary to participate. All of these little  gold nuggets of information contributed by a much larger group could be compiled easily (I should think) by the more experienced persons. The tests would need to be very, very basic. S-p-e-l-l it out, but don't be condescending!
I would love to do these little tests too :) Got plenty of time (and most likely enough experience) for something as basic as that :D

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There are people who know nothing of programming who are also very intelligent. There are also people who simply don't CARE about the programming part, and let's face it, -this is a programming enthusiast board more than it is a photography enthusiast board, no? If it offered more of the latter, perhaps there would be more persons willing to test.
That is kinda true...I love programming, have a very "programming-like" mind :P, but I code in PHP. But I do agree that there should be more "photography-related" sections of the forum. For example the "cool tricks with CHDK" was a great thread! There should be more like that :D

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Advanced members would need to moderate the "Junior Participant" section to post needed tests, put up polls to see result variations, and close threads when each particular test was completed. A dedicated page could be made for the results to be compiled, and again, a more experienced participant could analyze the data and make something of it.
Oooh yay! I choose...hmm...either wontolla, GrAnd, or DataGhost as my Advanced member! Whoever wants to participate in this :)

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This would also solve Barney Fifes justifiable grudge about info being scattered throughout the forum.
Oooh so THAT'S what he was mad about...I actually was trying to making this little Forum-tree to improve that. Anybody wanna join :D

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As a forum member with no experience who does wish to participate, I have no idea what I'm doing, and I could stumble upon something really significant and not realize it. I also end up asking questions about completely insignificant things that demonstrate my ignorance of all of this and am met with rather cold shouldered responses as if I'm 'bothersome".
That is totally how I feel :D

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For all of the members who do work very hard on CHDK and seem extremely "bothered" by those who have "user" interests and not necessarily "programmer" interests, this new section offers a place they can send those members.
Yay! Maybe then people like PsycoKitty won't get mad at me :D

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It's just a suggestion to help. I wish I could be of more help. As I told another member member, "I'm just a jeweler."
I really like your idea!!! I hope to be a part of it!


Next, GrAnd's post:
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I think, that's due to laziness of programmers. The are usually so disorganized. Smiley
They like to have fun with experiments and to talk off-topic. But when they were asked to summarize, structure and document their experience they have no time for that.  Tongue
Heh! I guess I am not the only one that thinks that :D. I think the ppl in CHDK are coding amazing things. Things that everybody should know about. However, installing it (maybe even using it) is just not too n00b friendly. And whenever I try to suggest a way to make it better, they tend to...eh...disapprove of it. I think that making stuff "n00b-friendly" might be my "nitche" as wontolla puts it. It's just being a n00b at this myself I don't have the "full picture" and therefore make stupid mistakes (like in the vid, I had no clue how the version numbers worked :P). However, now I think, I am learning more and more about CHDK, and soon I will actually be able to help with the organizing/summarizing/structuring bit!

Quote
Almost any newbie is so wowed, inspired and encouraged by CHDK first time and tempted to do something by himself. But when he looks deeper and faced with all these difficulties (not only in communication) he loses his motivation. Especially in case if the CHDK had been already ported to his cam. Not many goes further and continues digging in disassemblers. That's my opinion.
Yup! I was wowed. Still am wowed. And I really wanna help CHDK out. However I disagree with the losing motivation bit. I did not understand CHDK one bit when I came here. That just got me more motivated to try to do something! The thing that kinda dis-motivated me from posting my "ideas" is that people get kinda mad at them. However I am learning more about CHDK, so soon I might be able to post ideas that will actually work :D. As soon as I learn what a disassembler is.... :P

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PS. And not all persons, who have the knowledge, can type at 130wpm and knows English fluently.  Roll Eyes  (electronic dictionaries are rulez)
130wpm O.o daaang :D. I can only get up to 70-80 :D
« Last Edit: 08 / June / 2008, 17:33:30 by adcz »
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